Curse

Snow Bunny · Sep 25, 2007, 05:24 PM // 17:24

I've vanquished and gotten guardian with the same three heroes the whole time.

I'm set as Hybrid Prot LoD...so...yeah.

D/W
Wounding Strike, Faithful Intervention, Distracting Blow, Wildblow, Victorious Sweep, Res Signet, Heart of Fury, Chilling Victory

N/Mo
Jagged Bones, Animate Shambling Horror, Animate Bone Minions, Blood of the Master, Aegis, Res Signet, Death Nova, Dark Bond,

P/W
Spear of Lightning, Vicious Attack, Defensive Anthem, Anthem of Flame, Aggressive Refrain, Signet of Return, "Go for the Eyes!", "Never Surrender!"

The build doesn't appear to have much synergy, but, with a little bit of microing you do very well with this. I originally started my vanquishing trip with 2 E/A assassin's promise nukers, but I found that this could take pretty much anything. The only problems I have are against monk bosses with a lot of power. The build is pretty strong defensively. You have to micro Morghan's Anthem of Flame, so as to keep AR up for the IAS. But generally, this has been my staple across 3 continents.

Government Flu · Sep 25, 2007, 06:10 PM // 18:10

I've tried using this build against the Jade Brotherhood, but the sheer damage their casters dish out is just too overwhelming. Any suggestions on ways to mitigate the damage, or is this build not meant for that area?

On a side note, I managed to clear the lagoon with this build.

Snow Bunny · Sep 25, 2007, 08:21 PM // 20:21

I know exactly what you mean, especially with that Rit boss with the 400+ ancestor's rage spike.

It's all about mob control there. You need a dedicated, protted tank that can hold the aggro, and a monk that knows what prot he will need.

~ Dan ~ · Sep 25, 2007, 08:24 PM // 20:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sab

Attributes should be pretty straightforward, 12/12 or 12/9/9, any runes or no runes, it doesn't really matter.

lol QFT. I usually give my heroes complete pimpin, but for these i didn't have to

HM really does seem like normal mode, can't believe how much 3 hero builds have done for me. I'm now 1/3 to canthan vanquisher in 2 days or so

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

I've vanquished and gotten guardian with the same three heroes the whole time.

I'm set as Hybrid Prot LoD...so...yeah.

D/W
Wounding Strike, Faithful Intervention, Distracting Blow, Wildblow, Victorious Sweep, Res Signet, Heart of Fury, Chilling Victory

N/Mo
Jagged Bones, Animate Shambling Horror, Animate Bone Minions, Blood of the Master, Aegis, Res Signet, Death Nova, Dark Bond,

P/W
Spear of Lightning, Vicious Attack, Defensive Anthem, Anthem of Flame, Aggressive Refrain, Signet of Return, "Go for the Eyes!", "Never Surrender!"

The build doesn't appear to have much synergy, but, with a little bit of microing you do very well with this. I originally started my vanquishing trip with 2 E/A assassin's promise nukers, but I found that this could take pretty much anything. The only problems I have are against monk bosses with a lot of power. The build is pretty strong defensively. You have to micro Morghan's Anthem of Flame, so as to keep AR up for the IAS. But generally, this has been my staple across 3 continents.

I've always had problems in HM surviving without 1 solid hero healer. Monk hench just don't cut it. It works for you i guess because you're a monk, but that's why i specifically asked for builds that would work with any profession

Snow Bunny · Sep 25, 2007, 08:31 PM // 20:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by dan-the-noob

I've always had problems in HM surviving without 1 solid hero healer. Monk hench just don't cut it. It works for you i guess because you're a monk, but that's why i specifically asked for builds that would work with any profession

Good point.

These three can be reworked to more self-sustaining builds. I vanquished Old Ascalon with my warrior and these three (no monk) with a little tweaking in the self-sustainability department (insert Mystic Regen, Heal Area, Leader's Comfort, et cetera)

Fionn Falaich · Sep 26, 2007, 03:55 AM // 03:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by dan-the-noob

I've always had problems in HM surviving without 1 solid hero healer. Monk hench just don't cut it. It works for you i guess because you're a monk, but that's why i specifically asked for builds that would work with any profession

I am looking forward to trying the N/Rit builds in this thread. To your point about HM with hench monks, I vanquished all three continents with just two hench monks for 90% of the areas. For me, the hench monks' biggest shortfall in HM is that they do not pre-protect, so I worked some protection skills into my necro heroes. I found that I needed one or two hero monks (bonders) for the areas in Cantha that were heavy with Jade Brotherhood (T-Temple especially) and Wardens of Earth and Summer/Spring. For the rest, playing as an ele, I went as fire or air depending on the area (air for melee-heavy areas for blind and weakness), and my typical team build was MoW as basic SS with Protective Spirit (so that I could pre-prot when needed), Olias as MM with Aegis (same), Norgu as dom mesmer (mostly P-Block, Empathy, interrupts), and then two hench monks, and mostly two hench melee, although in Tyria I switched to only one hench melee along with Cynn, especially in the Shiverpeaks. It worked well, except for obviously quirky areas like Joko's and the Hidden City, which called for specific skill tweaks. Like I said, though, I am looking forward to trying the N/Rit setup. Sounds like it works quite well.

distilledwill · Sep 26, 2007, 08:53 AM // 08:53

This is what I ran through a few (high corpse count) missions yesterday:

Me: Ranger/Paragon.

[card]Prepared Shot[/card][card]Distracting Shot[/card][card]"Find Their Weakness!"[/card][card]"Go For The Eyes!"[/card][card]Keen Arrow[/card][card]Disrupting Accuracy[/card][card]Troll Unguent[/card][card]Signet Of Return[/card]

Marksmanship: 12 + 1 + 3
Expertise: 8 + 1
Wilderness Survival: 7 + 1
Command: 8

Rit Hero 1:

[card]Animate Flesh Golem[/card][card]Animate Bone Minions[/card][card]Spirit's Gift[/card][card]Boon Of Creation[/card][card]Explosive Growth[/card]Energetic Was Lee Sa[card]Life[/card][card]Death Pact Signet[/card]

Rit hero 2:

[card]Animate Flesh Golem[/card][card]Animate Bone Minions[/card][card]Spirit's Gift[/card][card]Boon Of Creation[/card][card]Explosive Growth[/card]Energetic Was Lee Sa[card]Recuperation[/card][card]Death Pact Signet[/card]

Both heroes are:
Spawning power: 12 + 1 + 3
Death Magic: 10
Restoration Magic: 8 + 1

Necro Hero:

[card]Jagged Bones[/card][card]Death Nova[/card]Putrid Bile[card]Barbs[/card][card]Mark Of Pain[/card][card]Mark Of Fury[/card][card]Suffering[/card][card]Flesh Of My Flesh[/card]

Death Magic: 10 + 1 + 2
Curses: 10 + 1
Soul Reaping: 10 + 1

The rits keep a steady stream of minions coming, including 2 golems, each time one dies it explodes, and is replaced by a jagged horror which activates all of the rit enchants, healing the caster/giving the caster energy back, healing all minions and allies around the created minion and exploding in the enemies face. When a bone minion is created, the enchants are activated twice (as 2 are created).
The spirits that they summon provide healing for all allies, including minions. (not really needed, but it helps)

The necro maintains death nova and jagged bones on those minions close to death. Causes incredible physical damage from barbs (about 15minions + barbs= ultimate death) this is spread over an area with Mark of Pain. He hits people with degen from putrid bile and suffering, causing the enemy to explode with damage to all surrounding foes from bile. Allows me and warrior hench to gain adrenhaline quicker through Mark of Fury

My ranger build increases the crit damage from minions and causes deep wound on as many enemies as posible with the shouts. and disruption through the prep and the interupt.

As long as you can kill a few enemies to get a couple of minions going this build can become pretty much unstoppable.
It excels in places with tonnes of corpses.
Any constructive criticism?

bungusmaximus · Sep 26, 2007, 11:06 AM // 11:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by distilledwill

Any constructive criticism?

Yeah, That ranger bar isn't really energy heavy if you ask me, except 'find your weakness', so I would replace prepared shot for broad head and take anthem of envy instead of 'find their weakness'. If a target is dazed and the minions start nibbling it he is pretty sure not to get a spell off.

distilledwill · Sep 26, 2007, 11:15 AM // 11:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

Yeah, That ranger bar isn't really energy heavy if you ask me, except 'find your weakness', so I would replace prepared shot for broad head and take anthem of envy instead of 'find their weakness'. If a target is dazed and the minions start nibbling it he is pretty sure not to get a spell off.

Hmm... i guess you're right, energy wasnt really a problem. I just wanted a nice elite.
BHA sounds like a plan.

However, I might conserve my adren' for GFTE, so as to spam it as often as is humanly posible.
Are there any other shouts/chants that will affect my minions?

Free Wind · Sep 26, 2007, 11:20 AM // 11:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by distilledwill

Are there any other shouts/chants that will affect my minions?

As far as I know no shouts/chants affect minions

distilledwill · Sep 26, 2007, 11:27 AM // 11:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Wind

As far as I know no shouts/chants affect minions

Wiki states that GFTE affects minions.

Free Wind · Sep 26, 2007, 11:37 AM // 11:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by distilledwill

Wiki states that GFTE affects minions.

And at the same time is says
"Although the skill suggests it affects the same people as Anthem of Envy, it seems to only affect allies in the party window. This would exclude, for example, people in the separate party in Vizunah Square, whereas Anthem of Envy includes them. "

Anyone can edit a wiki article. This very article used to tell it doesnt affect minions, go figure...

The problem is there is probably no way to check if GFTE does or doesnt affect minions

distilledwill · Sep 26, 2007, 11:47 AM // 11:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Wind

And at the same time is says
"Although the skill suggests it affects the same people as Anthem of Envy, it seems to only affect allies in the party window. This would exclude, for example, people in the separate party in Vizunah Square, whereas Anthem of Envy includes them. "

Anyone can edit a wiki article. This very article used to tell it doesnt affect minions, go figure...

The problem is there is probably no way to check if GFTE does or doesnt affect minions

Silly Wiki.

Ah well, I remember the major paragon nerf a few months ago, that did remove the reaches of most shouts/chants. Its a shame, that really gimped paras. Anyway, Im going to try this a bit more, then attempt to find a ranger build that synergises with the hero builds.

Either way, the 3 heroes work incredibly well together, and my ranger build was just a little extra.

bungusmaximus · Sep 26, 2007, 11:57 AM // 11:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by distilledwill

Silly Wiki.

Ah well, I remember the major paragon nerf a few months ago, that did remove the reaches of most shouts/chants. Its a shame, that really gimped paras. Anyway, Im going to try this a bit more, then attempt to find a ranger build that synergises with the hero builds.

Either way, the 3 heroes work incredibly well together, and my ranger build was just a little extra.

[wiki]mark of pain[/wiki] + [wiki]rapid fire[/wiki] = monster pwnage i think.

distilledwill · Sep 26, 2007, 12:17 PM // 12:17

If i was going to capitalise on the barbs + Mark of pain necro I could run a RaO spearchucker with a pet. That would be monster pwnage!
However, I'm looking for my character to be more of a support role seeing as there will be somewhere between 7-14 minions attacking the foes at any time anyway.

dead man ivan · Sep 26, 2007, 05:28 PM // 17:28

Did any of the users have problems with the builds? I gave olias the curses build & was running through magus stones & he didnt activate his skills at all not one!! I did try micro managing the skill bar but just couldnt do it quickly enough. However, towards the end of the run i.e. after I killed almost 300 enemies he starts using his skill set but only randomly & not for all of the groups.

Star Gazer · Sep 26, 2007, 05:36 PM // 17:36

just a thought ivan, you DID set him to guard and not avoid right? it can easily happen.

My Sweet Revenga · Sep 26, 2007, 06:29 PM // 18:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

[wiki]mark of pain[/wiki] + [wiki]rapid fire[/wiki] = monster pwnage i think.

Does MoP work now? Last time I used it was just after the AOE nerfing and I was disgusted with it because:

1) I would cast it on a moster
2) I would shoot that monster once, MOP was activated fine
3) MOP'd monster would instantly run back and out of the crowd allll they way back before I could even hit it with a second shot.
4) He runs back so far that this had a secondary effect of kiting my tank after him and aggroing MORE monsters. This was before we had more advanced party controls and when we had slow responding hench tank AI so the extra aggro was completely UNAVOIDABLE.

Thus I haven't used MOP since. But if it's been fixed, I might just dust it off and try it out again.

Woop Shotty · Sep 26, 2007, 08:13 PM // 20:13

Hmm. The 3 N/Rt thing helped me as Monk complete Fort Ranik HM. I had trouble with some groups in the past because we didn't bring anything to stop them from healing. With this, we killed the Overseers with no problem.

I had trouble at Nolani, though. I went around, and then lost on the first Charr mob after bonus completion. I guess it was death pact chain that was to blame for that. Only Olias died before that point, and only once.

It's nice and I'll try tweaking it some time to play in different places. Thanks.

Shai-hulud · Sep 26, 2007, 10:37 PM // 22:37

Used to play a build like:

Me (N/X)
[skill]Parasitic Bond[/skill][skill]Enfeeble[/skill][skill]Discord[/skill][skill]Necrosis[/skill][skill]Putrid Explosion[/skill][skill]Animate Shambling Horror[/skill][skill]Animate Bone Minions[/skill] and a ress skill (probably just a signet)

N/Rt
[skill]Mend Body and Soul[/skill][skill]Spirit Light[/skill][skill]Discord[/skill][skill]Life[/skill][skill]Putrid Flesh[/skill][skill]Animate Shambling Horror[/skill][skill]Signet of Lost Souls[/skill][skill]Flesh of My Flesh[/skill]

N/Rt
[skill]Mend Body and Soul[/skill][skill]Spirit Light[/skill][skill]Discord[/skill][skill]Recovery[/skill][skill]Death Nova[/skill][skill]Animate Shambling Horror[/skill][skill]Signet of Lost Souls[/skill][skill]Flesh of My Flesh[/skill]

Mo/Me
[skill]Light of Deliverance[/skill][skill]Remove Hex[/skill][skill]Protective Spirit[/skill][skill]Mend Condition[/skill][skill]Guardian[/skill][skill]Power Drain[/skill][skill]Leach Signet[/skill][skill]Ether Signet[/skill]

Since EotN some changes could be made, like adding [skill]Waste Not, Want Not[/skill]

These weren't the exact builds used, but I think you know how to tweak these

Use is prety straight forward, cast a hex and condition and spike an opponent down. The monk can be replaced by another N/Rt, you can play duo with a total of 6 N/Rt's or even 8 N/Rt's but then some skills should be changed, 2 times the same spirit is useless and with two human players one could bring a hex and enfeeble while the other only brings a hex (there are enough conditions, enfeeble is mostly to create some corpses)
Basically just spiking down the strongest opponents first, seems the heroes use discord very well

Used the build to do all of Elona. The build is prety solid or at least that was what we found, but in HM there could be some problems because the minions will be slaughtered very quickly (but then again if the opponent warriors/eles and so on are spiked down before they even do anything that shouldn't be a problem either

)

About the first build posted here (with the 3 N/Rt's) I think I have a problem with the rit healer being on guard and having an item. Not being on guard (avoid) means the hero doesn't use [skill]Signet of Lost Souls[/skill] while being on guard with an item spell will end up that the hero is tanking instead of me...any suggestions or is it just bad watching from my side?